DaySailer.org Forum

I wish to add jiffy reefing to my DS I. I've researched how this is rigged on bigger boats, with cheek blocks and cleats on the boom.

But my gut says all that may make sense for a bigger boat to haul down an overpowered sail, but for a lake-sailed daysailer where we only go out for one or two hours at a time, all I'd need are a couple fore and aft eyestraps on the boom to serve as an anchoring point for lines I'd use to simply lash the sail's reef points to the boom. I'd expect in all cases we'd set the reef before raising the sail.

I'm not trying to avoid buying $50 worth of blocks and cleats, but it just seems like overkill on a lake-sailed 17 foot Daysailer.

Any thoughts? I'm wondering how other DS's are rigged for jiffy reefing and owners' satisfaction with same.

Thanks

I've been considering the same thing.

I've had reef points in my sails for a while and have used them, in an improvised fashion, by lashing them to the boom.

I can speak to some aspects of your question. One is that I've found it useful being able to reef. I'm not always out with a crew, or one that can handle higher winds, and I've enjoyed being able to depower by reefing.

I'm also far from perfect in predicting when I'll need a reef. Where I put in, it's usually a bit sheltered, so it's diffcult to know how hard it will blow further out, or around the nearest headland. From that, I know that I want to be able to put in a reef on the water.

Fiddling with lines at the end of the boom, is not my idea of fun in a blow , so I know I'd want at least the rear line come forward along the boom. At that point, you're half way there to single-line reefing.

My questions are therefore more focused. Is single line reefing the way to go, or do I keep the lines separate? (I don't have a reef hook, otherwise that wouldn't even be a question.)

In designing a system, one factor might be the load on the reef line (and on the blocks, eyes, fasteners). With a single line system, you have essentially 4 strands of reefing line counteracting the pull of the halyard (as well as some additional force to keep the sail flat fore and aft).
So the fittings could be half as strong as what would be required for the halyard (not 1/4, because of allowing for the sideways pull), which means the hardware doesn't have to be massive.

The other aspect is the placement.

I would be curious to learn about details of working setups.

Yesterday morning I got around to figuring out the reefing for my main. It's a new Intensity, which comes with patches & cringles at the luff and leech for a single reef. After estimating where the reefed clew would end up (not so far in front of the unreefed clew, surprisingly), I installed a small metal eye on the port side and a plastic eye/fairlead on the starboard--roughly one foot from the end of the boom. Can measure if anyone likes. I ran the reef line (1/4" doublebraid) from the eye (with just a tight bowline), up through the cringle, then down to the fairlead, then forward along the bottom of the boom. To keep it clear of stuff, I led it through the mainsheet boom block shackle, then through the vang shackle to the mast. There I simply passed it around the mast (Ugly! Will fix!) and back to a cleat on the cuddy top.

For the tack, the way I worked it is to pass the cunningham through the reef cringle, then around the mast and through the cringle going the other way, then down to its cleat. Worked like a champ. Kept the tack right where it needed to be, hard up against the mast and down right there at the gooseneck.

Yesterday down in Pueblo (solo) I reefed and unreefed about three times as the wind built during the day. Worked great. Free both sheets. Lower the sail to about the right place. Do the cunningham thing (15 seconds). Re-tension the halyard (nice and tight). Take up on the reef line--also nice and tight. Back to the tiller, in on the sheets.

The sail looked really great--nice and flat. I was able to point just fine, and it really did reduce the white-knuckle part of heavy wind. I'm thinking about pure single-line reefing (the same line passes through fairleads up forward to take care of the tack) but I'm not sure there's benefit after seeing how easy the cunningham trick works.

I didn't bother tying the housekeeping lines along the sail--really no need.

Our boom has roller reefing built in. Simply uncleat the halyard and (requires two people) lower the main as the boom is pulled backward and rolled.

Sounds easy but we have yet to try it. The problem is the main sheet block (about mid-boom) is fastened with shackle to a bail and requires unscrewing its pin (without dropping either) before the block can be removed.

What would be much better is a snap shackle on one end and pin on the other, then releasing the block would be a...er...snap! But -- I have yet to find such an animal. Anyone know if they exist?

Thanks.

Today I tried a jury rig reefing arrangement like the one John M. describes, but found that when lowering the mainsail the aft end of the boom would drop down too low and smash into the motor mounted on the transom, so I abandoned the effort before doing further damage! I suppose that if the motor hadn't been there I might have had time to raise the aft end of the boom by securing the cringle nearest to the leach. Next year I'll try to rig up something more permanent, but I'm wondering if a topping lift, which I don't currently have, is essential for reefing. Also, when done properly, does reefing leave the boom height the same as when under full sail?

Reefing while underway is always more of a challenge than reefing at the dock. I find having a topping lift makes it much easier. The heave to maneuver makes it much less stressful, as well. I have a 2nd out hall rigged to the reefing clew that's run through a cheek block and then forward on the boom to a cleat. I have a reefing hook at the tack which makes it pretty quick to deal with it at that end. With this setup I can do the entire reefing while standing next to the edge of the cuddy. It's always a good idea to practice heaving to and reefing, when you don't really need it, to get the bugs worked out.

KC

I've added single line reefing, but I'm not sure I've arrived at the best setup. (For one, I don't have a topping lift yet). I've posted some pix showing the setup at the front end of the boom. Cheek block on the port side and an eye and cleat on the starboard side.

At the aft end of the boom (sorry, no pictures) another cheek block on the starboard side, positioned directly underneath the clew location for the unreefed sail, so the reef line pulls down and back. For now, the free end of the line goes around the outhaul cleat on the starboard side, which is an inch or two further aft.

So far, this seems to work to hold the reefed sail in a reasonable position, but getting it there is not as easy as simply pulling on a single line. And I've had second thoughts about the jam cleat, because it doesn't hold the line well, when slack. Suggestions welcome.

GreenLake,

My thoughts on the reefing hook; it's simple and quick to use, inexpensive (like $12), and it's always rigged. With a separate out hall it's easy to put a good amount of tension to flatten the sail.

Your rig looks interesting and if it had worked as a one line does it all, I sure can see the appeal. As far as the clam cleat goes, I have both a clam cleat and a horn cleat on my boom, left over from the previous owner. I use the clam cleat for the regular out hall and find it easy to use, where as the horn cleat is a nuisance. Possibly your setup would work better if you had no excess line and could put and S-knot at the end to hold it in place when slack.

KC

K.C. not having extra line when the line is slack would help. When the sail is removed, there's all that extra line again and no good place to belay it. Could be that this kind of setup really works better for boats that are kept in the water. A cam cleat would have the advantage that it would hold a line without a lot of tension.

About a reef hook. Is that something that I can retrofit given the way the boom is set up at the gooseneck end? If yes, then that might be a better way.

Leading the reef line from the back forward along the boom even if it is only used for reefing the leech has the davantage that one doesn't need to work near the end of the boom when the boat is under way. I've managed that before when I had a provisional setup, but as a test in lighter winds.

I also made the experience that the weight of the boom interferes with reefing the back end of the sail (that one as tried at the dock). Could be that a topping lift is really required for this kind of setup.

GreenLake, the reef hook is attached to the boom immediately aft of the gooseneck. It would be an easy installation. I've got the simple hook and have never used the ram horn style so can't comment. However, the ram horn style might be even easier to deal with, in that the sail would stay attached easier, though I'm not sure if that. It might be worth investigating before purchasing.

My reefing out hall line is attached to the reefing clew crinkle with a snap shackle. This makes rigging it down through the cheek block and forward to the cleat pretty quick. However, I don't often rig it unless I know the winds are going to be blowing. Even though it only takes 15 to 30 seconds to rig.

I was out in a blow this summer with a friend of mine who likes to sail in high wind. It had been blowing for a couple of days and we were comparing boats in high wind. We came pretty close to capsizing the 3 boats that we compared, the Laser, the Hobie Cat, and the Daysailer. I should have reefed before leaving the dock. Once I got the boat reefed and got the jib down the boat actually sailed faster because I could keep it on its feet.

Saturday I went down to Sound thinking that I would get my last sail of the season in. NOAA predicted the winds to be 8 kn gusting to 12 kn. When I got down to the boat ramp it was definitely blowing 20 kn +. I guess the small craft advisory that was predicted for further out had moved in already. A lot of fishermen were coming in saying that it was really bad out there with water breaking over the rails there boats. Needless to say, I didn't choose to go out.

KC

K.C. Walker wrote:The reef hook is attached to the boom immediately aft of the gooseneck. It would be an easy installation. I've got the simple hook and have never used the ram horn style so can't comment. However, the ram horn style might be even easier to deal with, in that the sail would stay attached easier, though I'm not sure if that. It might be worth investigating before purchasing.

K.C., pardon me for being a bit dense here. The only one I've seen advertised is something like this one. Is that what you consider a simple hook? It would appear to be in conflict with part of the existing boom cap casting (mine is like this one.)

If you had something different in mind, could you clarify?

K.C. Walker wrote:My reefing out haul line is attached to the reefing clew cringle with a snap shackle. This makes rigging it down through the cheek block and forward to the cleat pretty quick. However, I don't often rig it unless I know the winds are going to be blowing. Even though it only takes 15 to 30 seconds to rig.

Mine goes up from the boom, through the cringle (or grommet) in the sail and back down to the cheeck block. Doing that gives me a 2:1 purchase.

We sometimes get a sea-breeze in the afternoon which is difficult to predict in strength. You end up going out in moderate winds, get stuck in a flat calm for a while, and then the breeze kicks in.

Hey GreenLake, no problem. This is a set up that came with my boat. http://www.walkerguitars.com/photos/day ... 132973.jpg Defender seems to have similar hooks here. They also have the ram horn style. http://www.defender.com/productsearchresult.jsp

To use these hooks you don't need to use any line. You just slack the main halyard, hook the reef crinkle and re-tighten the halyard.

My standard out hall I rig as you do with a 2 to 1. The reefing out hall I just run a single line from crinkle to cheek block and forward. I seem to be able to get enough tension on the foot by giving it a good yank.

KC

K.C. I think a reefing hook like the one you are showing looks promising. I'll mull it over before drilling yet more holes in my boom.

My main problem with the single line seems to be that when I pull on it, it does reef the front of the sail, but seems to not want to act on the rear with equal ease. That might be fixed/improved by adding a topping lift, do that the reef line wouldn't have to lift the boom. The more I think about it, the more I realize I'm missing a topping lift anyway. If I change things to a reefing hook in front, I'll free up a cheek block to use for a topping lift. So far so good.

Finally, I'm still not clear about how the rear of your boom is set up when you reef your sail. Do you have a reef line in addition to an out-haul when you reef? (Meaning, two lines in addition to the standard outhaul for the unreefed sail?) So far, I only have a reef line. It's configured to give some pull backwards, as well as pulling down. The foot tension is not adjustable (always "high") because by definition, when you reef you want a flat sail. (Or is there a flaw in my reasoning?)

The whole setup is rather recent, so I haven't tried it in earnest (that is in high winds), but so far, it seems to give me reasonable foot tension.

GreenLake,

Just think of those holes as strategic lightning of your boom.

For reefing the leech/clew I use a single line attached to the reef crinkle with a shackle. That line goes down to a cheek block that's near the end of the boom, I would guess 3 inches in from the end, and then cleated 2/3s of the way forward on the boom. The reefed "foot" tension would be adjustable, but as you say, tight is what you want. Think of it like a shortened loose footed main.

KC

K.C. Walker wrote:GreenLake,
Just think of those holes as strategic lightning of your boom.

Funny!